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hal

United Kingdom
34 Posts

Posted - 04/17/2005 :  04:13:19 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
hello folks.
ive read a lot about conversational hypnosis but have never actually managed to read a transcript on such a session.
would be very interesting to look at such an article,and info on this subject.
does anyone know wher i may find more info on this,everything i seem to read never acytally gets to the bare bones of it.

hal

anthony

Canada
305 Posts

Posted - 04/17/2005 :  5:21:11 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
"Conversational Hypnosis" eh? Well if I used that term, I would know exactly what I meant by it, but I am curious to know what your definition is since you seem to think that someone could write you a script to read, and have it work, while my difinition demands years of experience and the ability to think on your feet.....
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HypnoDoc

USA
365 Posts

Posted - 04/17/2005 :  10:01:31 PM  Show Profile  Visit HypnoDoc's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Anthony - The guy just asked about it, he didn't say he had any definition for it, nor did he say anything about reading any script.

Hal - These people must know something about the subject as they have a registered trademark on the name "Conversational Hypnosis®" You may get a bit of information reading through their pages even though they are really written to sell their CD teaching it.

http://align2success.com/cd001.html

And yes, you are right, there is very little information about it online and most all web sites that use the phrase are using it as a sales promotion tool.

Hope this helps.

HypnoDoc

"Relax, Listen and ______ with Hypnosis" Audio Series.
(MP3 Instant Download, CD, and Cassettes)
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quote:
"Words are the most powerful drug used by mankind." Rudyard Kipling.
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anthony

Canada
305 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2005 :  12:22:01 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Well, I can;t speak for others, but I find it impossible to repy with any post that makes sense, when I have no idea what is intended by the question. I have never hear of the term, but do understand the words. Therefor I ask for a difinition. Perhaps you have one?
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HypnoDoc

USA
365 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2005 :  1:31:44 PM  Show Profile  Visit HypnoDoc's Homepage  Reply with Quote
The only thing I know about it was what I read on the link above. Other than that, it would appear to be just another "catch phrase" to help sales. I mean what's the opposite... Silent Hypnosis? Unspoken Hypnosis?

HypnoDoc
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mark-gil

United Kingdom
445 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2005 :  1:48:07 PM  Show Profile  Visit mark-gil's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Conversational Hypnosis is a term used by Ericksonian Hypnotherapists
to create a trance by using "imbedded words" in the verbal text. I have a video tape of a demonstration at the annual Erickson Conference. My opinion is that it is unethical because the client has a right to knowingly participate in the development of trance. Conversational Hypnosis and confusion techniques are the tools of those who continue to speak of "resistant and/or difficult"clients. These methods treat the client as a victim of trance rather than a willing and active participant. Finally, beware of web products that use over the top superlatives and statements like"unaware of trance", and other terms indicating manipulating the client outside their awareness.
With Respect, Gil Boyne

Gil Boyne
www.gil-boyne.com
[Gil Passed Away May 5, 2010]

Edited by - mark-gil on 10/07/2005 10:18:17 PM
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anthony

Canada
305 Posts

Posted - 04/19/2005 :  09:49:56 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thank you for the explanation Mark, I had never heard of the term, though the words suggested something of that nature. I have use covert induction for fun, and since the client chose to visit me for help, I didn't see it as covert, but I do understand your concern.
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hal

United Kingdom
34 Posts

Posted - 04/19/2005 :  2:57:59 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Re conversational hypnosis,yes i do realise i would not be able to read a script on this subject.
Thought it may be interestong to read an actual session or whatever one wishes to call it using this method.
By the way i didnt know it was registered or anything of the like,as it has been used for such a long time and is nothing new to be reinvented.
I have read quite a bit on Eriksons use of it but would still like to "see it in action",as used present day.

strange answers and a little snobbery here i suspect.
One does not need to know what a subject is about to seek question on it,after all this is the idea of asking questions is it not.
We are all at different levels of experience on this journey in life and should seek to help those not travelled as far on the path as ourselves.
after all there may be some one ahead whose help we seek some day.
As a man thinketh so shall he be.


hal
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anthony

Canada
305 Posts

Posted - 04/20/2005 :  10:02:19 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Not sure were the snobbery comes in, but I don't see the replies as shtrange, I got what I asked for, clarity as to were the term came from, I had never heard it used before. As for sharing, the only way wee can share, is to understand what is being asked.
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John D

United Kingdom
34 Posts

Posted - 05/25/2005 :  2:08:03 PM  Show Profile  Visit John D's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by hal

Re conversational hypnosis,yes i do realise i would not be able to read a script on this subject.
Thought it may be interestong to read an actual session or whatever one wishes to call it using this method.
By the way i didnt know it was registered or anything of the like,as it has been used for such a long time and is nothing new to be reinvented.
I have read quite a bit on Eriksons use of it but would still like to "see it in action",as used present day.

strange answers and a little snobbery here i suspect.
One does not need to know what a subject is about to seek question on it,after all this is the idea of asking questions is it not.
We are all at different levels of experience on this journey in life and should seek to help those not travelled as far on the path as ourselves.
after all there may be some one ahead whose help we seek some day.
As a man thinketh so shall he be.




Hal, your question was clear, you just asked if anyone knows what "conversational hypnosis" is and where to find information about it. I think that it would be prudent when people don't know anything about a topic to not attack the inquirer simply because they cannot answer his or her inquiry and, also, should not provide information which is superficial and subjective, based on misinformation and personal likes and dislikes.

Conversational Hypnosis is a well-tested and effective Ericksonian technique. It is not used specifically to overcome the resistances of "difficult" clients (the term "difficult client" is never used by Ericksonian therapists, the term "unskilled therapist" is used instead) and it is definitely not a "farce" or unethical in any way, as claimed by some posters here who obviously have not the slightest idea of what they are talking about.

It is one of the most effective and efficient techniques of hypnotherapy in producing quick and permanent therapeutic results. However, special training and skills are necessary to be able to effectively use this technique.

The "imbedded" words are spoken in a tone of voice and with an emphasis that is different to that used for the rest of the talk. This is preceded by specially formulated suggestions, or communications to the subconscious mind (whatever that is) to listen and pick up the messages imbedded in the talk that follows. The intention of those imbedded words is to be picked up directly by the subconscious mind while the conscious mind is lulled by the rest of the talk. This is extremely powerful and does not involve deception since the client has come to the therapist specifically for expert help so that he or she can achieve desirable changes within themselves.

It has been termed conversational hypnosis because, in contrast to the traditional "hypnotic talk", this type of hypnotic therapy is delivered in the form of an ordinary conversation or in a narrative form like when you tell an ordinary story to someone.
Milton Erickson was a genius and the techniques and approaches to hypnotherapy that he developed may have been refined by others over the years, but they have not been bested by anyone up to this date.

And, yes, there are scripts which are not just induction scripts, but scripts of entire therapies. Of course, these scripts are intended for use by trainees or beginners, experienced therapists prepare their own scripts according to the specific needs of each individual client.

John S. Dovelos, Ph.D.
Athenaeum University International
www.unicollege-edu.net
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paul jones

United Kingdom
5 Posts

Posted - 06/23/2005 :  9:07:02 PM  Show Profile  Visit paul jones's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hi Hal, I think I agree with Gil up to a point regarding the opacity of the therapy for the client. using hypnosis as a tool, one must also have a protocol based upon sound psychological principles, and more often than not if the client is aware of this then the therapy will go better.

however...i see no harm in offering the client new ways of conceptualising things whilst they are awake..
i think the techniques you are looking for are things like
the double bind - "would you feel happier in this chair or that chair?"
or the imbedded suggestion" (can you)imagine now that you are feeling hapier"
or the compound suggestion"let's talk about your happiyness (the emphasis here is on the phonetic delivery - lets talk about you're happy ness)"
the relation of action / behaviour to meaning: " and as you happily continue to breathe normally"
the implicit sugestion: "perhaps your noticing now that it is in fact my voice that is helping to feel so happy"

despite the seeming elegance (and actual difficulty of being able to just throw these into a flowing conversation) don't allow yourself to get bogged down in perfection of technique with out fully understanding the philosophical nature of the change you are trying to bring about in you r clients (ie. altering the actual nature of mental constructs).

the techniques above are just tricks of the trance *, and alone will offer no long term change.
I recomend "Sleight of Mouth" by Dilts - a nice guide to reframing

*i am not a state theorist by the way i subscribe more to the Wagstaff Spanos cognitive compliance and beleif hypothesis.
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shamlyn

10 Posts

Posted - 11/17/2005 :  1:26:10 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I am in agreement with the statements made by "John D".

Also, the use of conversational hypnosis is as ethical as the hypnotist using such techniques.

It is as ethical as attempting an instant induction (say the arm-pull (one I don’t personally subscribe to), or pattern-interrupt) on an unsuspecting subject.

If the subject is expecting to be hypnotised then I feel that the various methods employed in conversational hypnosis are quite ethical.

If you are going to attempt these techniques on an unsuspecting subject, then this is obviously unethical. It is up to the hypnotist to be professional in these matters.

For example, do anaesthetists knock out a patient without the patients consent?

Erickson demonstrated that conversational hypnosis techniques (often incorporating confusion) were successful in hypnotising people who were not expecting to be hypnotised (however Erickson’s' reputation as a hypnotist was known to the subjects so there is an open argument of expectation on the part of the subject making the process smother for Erickson).

Have a good dig around the internet for the techniques used by Erickson. You will get a good high level outline of the techniques.

Some of the details of Erickson’s techniques and other related training material can be a bit difficult to get hold unless you are a health professional.

Hope this helps a little.

Steve
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shamlyn

10 Posts

Posted - 11/17/2005 :  1:31:19 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Another point to be aware of is that Erickson did not use scripts for the conversation. He had a number of techniques he would use and the converstaion was add-libbed and taylored to the client/subject as he went along.

Erickson was an absolute master of these techniques and you have to see him in full-swing, as it were, to see how skilled he was at his art.

Steve
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n/a

162 Posts

Posted - 12/15/2005 :  8:43:10 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Conversational hypnosis = Waking Hypnosis ---see Dave Elmans explaination in his book. Obviously Gil would have knowledge of this, having produced Daves book
Salute
Mike
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Finder

1 Posts

Posted - 01/06/2007 :  09:08:49 AM  Show Profile  Visit Finder's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by hal
does anyone know wher i may find more info on this,everything i seem to read never acytally gets to the bare bones of it.


Hi hal,

Start by checking out Milton H. Erickson My Voice Will Go With You - put together by Sidney Rosen. A great and exciting place to start to learn about one of the best Hypnotherapists ever to live.
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Sombudude

USA
18 Posts

Posted - 02/12/2007 :  03:56:10 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
To help a hypno newb out here. Is conversational hypnosis now coined as NLP? I know there are various faucets of NLP, but I viewed a clip online about a guy that could make his friends want the gifts he got them by inbedding key words in conversation. The vid was labled NLP demo.

Millions of electrons were violently inconvenienced to post this message.
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Matrixman

United Kingdom
399 Posts

Posted - 02/12/2007 :  06:58:17 AM  Show Profile  Visit Matrixman's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hi

The answer to this question, as a number of possible answers, is NLP conversational hypnosis in many ways yes, as it does embody, conversational hypnosis in the form of the Milton Model named after Milton H, Erickson, yet Erickson hypnotherapy is also independent as a self contained and governed By the Milton Erickson foundation, which is very independent body of knowledge and skill sets.

NLP is a technology, that uses, a set of linguistic tools, to work out how somebody does something, if you want to get a set of the difference then check out www.nlpu.com this is the home of Robert Dilts one of the very best NLP developers in the world, read the articles, once you have read at lest 5 then go and check out www.indirect-hypnosis.com/mp3downloads.htm" target="_blank">http://www.indirect-hypnosis.com/mp3downloads.htm down load the mp3’s and you will get a fuller sense and be able to answer your own questions.

Jay

If it has consciousness it's already in a trance.
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Sombudude

USA
18 Posts

Posted - 02/12/2007 :  07:25:31 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thank you for the response. I will read a few articles to sort it out for myself. Thanks again.

Millions of electrons were violently inconvenienced to post this message.
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mark-gil

United Kingdom
445 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2007 :  3:15:48 PM  Show Profile  Visit mark-gil's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Posted - 11/17/2005 : 1:26:10 PM
It is as ethical as attempting an instant induction (say the arm-pull (one I dont personally subscribe to), or pattern-interrupt on an unsuspecting subject.


The use of the word "unsuspecting" changes
the entire context of the above quote. I teach that when the therapist is ready to induce the trance, he asks the client,"are you ready to be hypnotized". When the client replies "yes", he is no longer "unsuspecting"

Gil Boyne
www.gil-boyne.com
[Gil Passed Away May 5, 2010]

Edited by - mark-gil on 07/04/2007 3:17:42 PM
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Dr.MichaelHarris

USA
2 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2007 :  10:31:40 PM  Show Profile  Visit Dr.MichaelHarris's Homepage  Reply with Quote
There are several good books on conversational hypnosis
Trance-formations by Bandler and Grinder
Training Trances by Overdurf & Silverthorn
Hypnotic patterns of Milton H. Erickson I & II by Bandler and Grinder
Any of the books or papers written by Milton Erickson or about him.

If you want to know more about Ericksonian Hypnosis which is all
conversational go to the Milton H. Erickson Foundation.

Conversational hypnosis is really no different that listening to an interesting story. Images, sounds and emotional/feeling words and phrases, metaphor, paradox, mystery, suspense are all part of this technology.

NLP and Neuro-Semantics are entire technologies that have been formed for using the same language pattern that lead clients into closed-eye trance only most of the time in conversation their eyes are open, but not always

What it really boils down to is trance a phenomena that is induced or is a naturally occuring human pattern?

For most Clinical Hypnotists, trance is something that they do to or with their clients. For Ericksonian Hypnotists, trance is the constant and all you have to do is wait for the next one to come around and jump on board.

If you want more you can email me


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patrickg

USA
724 Posts

Posted - 12/17/2007 :  9:25:10 PM  Show Profile  Visit patrickg's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Conversational Hypnosis/Covert Hypnosis/Waking Hypnosis/Eyes-open Hypnosis/NLP/Persuasion Techniques.

You say tomato I say tomato. (pronounce the second one different)

There will be differences between them, but they are just different ways to get to the same place.

It seems that the people that really highlight or push one version or the other have a financial or identity interest in that particular flavor.

- Along with other resources mentioned, there is a lot of info on this stuff with a scientific bend on Kevin Hogan's site - www.kevinhogan.com (my personal favorite, along with Ellman, Boyne and Kein.)

Find the one that fits your personality and try it out :)

Patrick Glancy
www.glancyhypnosis.com

Patrick Glancy, CI, BCH
www.salemhypnosissolutions.com

Edited by - patrickg on 12/17/2007 11:43:46 PM
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ForumMaster

USA
669 Posts

Posted - 04/11/2008 :  8:01:36 PM  Show Profile  Visit ForumMaster's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Conversational Hypnosis appears to be the latest buzz word (phrase) used online to promote "Covert or Seduction Hypnosis." Since most all professional Hypnotherapists worldwide feel that it is unethical to attempt to Hypnotize someone without their knowledge or consent we do not allow posts in the forum that promote that type of scam to the public. We have had a high incident of spam posts in recent weeks (which moderators have deleted or edited) and we will continue to not allow these bogus posts in the HOL forums.

By posting their links to their bogus techniques in our forums they look to try to associate themselves with legitimate Hypnosis and gain higher rank in the Search Engines by linking to the HOL web site.

The public should be aware and not be duped by these buzz words that are used to promote training courses for such nonsense. All Hypnosis is self Hypnosis - you cannot be hypnotized without your knowing or hypnotize anyone else without their allowing it to happen. To try to do so in some covert or conversational way is pure fantasy contrived to promote the sales of bogus products or training courses.

ForumMaster

Bigger is better! 150+ Scripts is now...
"250+ Scripts for Hypnosis Therapy."
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knightC

1 Posts

Posted - 04/30/2008 :  08:42:08 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'm new to hynosis in genersl and I'm not sure what 'conversational hypnosis' is all about. But I 'm came across this site that just might she some light on it. If you're interested:

( NO CLICK BANK LINKS ALLOWED )

Let me know if this helped.

Edited by - Matrixman on 04/30/2008 08:47:23 AM
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